03/11/04 This is absolutely great...The Shape of Things to Come
From: "Erwin Hitz"
Date: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:20 am

Someone sent me the following. It is amusing and at the same time
alarming. I just thought I'd share it with the group.

Operator: "Thank you for calling (Pizza Vendor)
How May I serve you..."

Customer: "Hi, I'd like to order."

Operator: "May I have your NIDN first, sir?"

Customer: "My National ID Number, yeah, hold on, eh, it's 6102049998-
45-54610."

Operator: "Thank you, Mr. Sheehan. I see you live at 1742 Meadowland
Drive, and the phone number's 494-2366. Your office number over at
Lincoln Insurance is 745-2302 and your cell number's 266-2566. Which
number are you calling from, sir?"

Customer: "Huh? I'm at home. Where d'ya get all this information?"

Operator: "We're wired into the system, sir."

Customer: (Sighs) "Oh, well, I'd like to order a couple of your All-
Meat Special pizzas..."

Operator: "I don't think that's a good idea, sir."

Customer: "Whaddya mean?"

Operator: "Sir, your medical records indicate that you've got very
high blood pressure and extremely high cholesterol. Your National
Health Care provider won't allow such an unhealthy choice."

Customer: "Damn. What do you recommend, then?"

Operator: "You might try our low-fat Soybean Yogurt Pizza. I'm sure
you'll like it"


Customer: "What makes you think I'd like something like that?"

Operator: "Well, you checked out 'Gourmet Soybean Recipes' from your
local library last week, sir. That's why I made the suggestion."

Customer: "All right, all right. Give me two family-sized ones,
then. What's the damage?"

Operator: "That should be plenty for you, your wife and your four
kids, sir. The 'damage,' as you put it, heh, heh, comes $49.99."

Customer: "Lemme give you my credit card number."

Operator: "I'm sorry sir, but I'm afraid you'll have to pay in cash.
Your credit card balance is over its limit."

Customer: "I'll run over to the ATM and get some cash before your
driver gets here."

Operator: "That won't work either, sir. Your checking account's
overdrawn."

Customer: "Never mind. Just send the pizzas. I'll have the cash
ready. How long will it take?"

Operator: "We're running a little behind, sir. It'll be about 45
minutes, sir. If you're in a hurry you might want to pick 'em up
while you're out getting the cash, but carrying pizzas on a
motorcycle can be a little awkward."

Customer: "How the hell do you know I'm riding a bike?"

Operator: "It says here you're in arrears on your car payments, so
your car got repo'ed. But your Harley's paid up, so I just assumed
that you'd be using it."

Customer: "@#%/$@&?#!"

Operator: "I'd advise watching your language, sir. You've already
got a July 2006 conviction for cussing out a cop."

Customer: (Speechless)

Operator: "Will there be anything else, sir?"

Customer: "No, nothing. oh, yeah, don't forget the two free liters
of Coke your ad says I get with the pizzas."

Operator: "I'm sorry sir, but our advert's exclusionary clause
prevents us from offering free
soda to diabetics."

Customer: (Speechless)

Operator: "The computer screen has just flashed two additional
warning alerts. It indicates you are 50 pounds overweight and the
Federal Standard determines that anyone 30 pounds overweight is
considered obese. If the pending legislations against fast food and
obesity are enacted, we will not be able to accept your food orders
in the future"

Customer: " I'll remember that."

Operator: "The other warning indicates you purchase a carton of
cigarettes once each week at your local Super Market. Of course we
do not know how many extra packages you purchase from various
vending machines, but this indicates you are a smoker. When you come
to pick up your Pizza order, please wait in the parking lot at the
bright orange table under the sign that says I SMOKE. Use the
intercom provided to let us know you have arrived. We can not
permit you to enter our premises, since your lungs still contain
abundant amounts of secondary smoke which is released each time you
exhale. This secondary smoke would contaminate our employees and
customers. Your Pizza Order will be delivered to you at the table by
an employee, who will be wearing the appropriate breathing
protection devices."

THANK YOU FOR SELECTING ( PIZZA VENDOR), and HAVE A NICE DAY!!!!

ABSURD?? We are not far away from the above scenario. This is the
direction our society is going. George Orwell wrote the book 1984 (
all about Big Brother). He missed the title by 20 years. It should
have been called 2004.

---

03/11/04 My Response to Graham's Letter
From: "Garnet Dawn"
Date: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:17 am
Subject: Smoking and Civil Rights (Federal Obesity Funding)

Hi Graham,

You missed my point on the article I posted from the Wall Street Journal. I believe the purpose of Florida Smokers, Illinois Smokers, Forces International, Smoking Club, etc. is really Civil Rights. Yesterday and today the target of bans and taxes is Smoking. Tomorrow it can be food, coffee, soft drinks, privacy or whatever Antis and Power Freaks choose. I am a smoker and a citizen of this country. I will respect individual businesses/entrepreneurs' choices, but I cannot stand by and watch our Government and gigantic health organizations spend tax dollars on any pet project they currently choose as important. This will only lead to more legislation for our (the individual's) own good. I believe our public representatives have forgotten that they SERVE the public, they do not and should not CONTROL their stockholders and constituents. We should have some control over how our tax dollars are being spent. That is why I object to accepting every new whim our government and their "educated" advisors propose.

Sincerely,
Garnet Dawn, Illinois Resident


Graham wrote: Hi Dawn,

Yes we should have expected this, of course. Only lets not get side-tracked. We at Florida-smokers tend to pass the buck a little to often and I have done it my-self in the past (but no more)....

---

03/11/04 Graham's response to my letter "Federal Obesity Funding"
From: Graham Nabb
Date: Thu Mar 11, 2004 5:18 am
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers] Federal Obesity Funding

Hi Dawn,

Yes we should have expected this, of course. Only lets not get side-tracked. We at Florida-smokers tend to pass the buck a little to often and I have done it my-self in the past (but no more).

The sooner we are all accountable for us being smokers the better and except that most peoples and statistics point of view is that our smoke not only causes our-selves considerable damage (what's it like to run for a bus etc) it hurts and we know it. Also yes the costs to the tax payer in funding smoking related illnesses, but also and lets not forget the same for passive smoking, needless to say the smell (on clothes also)that smoke makes in an enclosed environment (restaurants, theatre's, etc, etc) So we need to understand fully, non smokers concerns.

This passing the buck on to other issues in my experience is our hard-ship and the extreme difficulty in giving up. Any-one who does not want to give up (most do so) because they say they enjoy it are either stupid (health reasons alone) or they need to GET REAL.

Yesterday in the UK was no smoking day and the statistics of smoking related deaths and illnesses over the past year are frightening, really do we want to be "our-selves" a statistic in any country.

We can all GET REAL on this and stop passing the buck, lets give non smokers some respect. I do now and am also slowly giving up, my health is improving and its because I am being accountable for my own actions.


Regards, Graham

---

03/10/04 Federal Obesity Funding
From: "Garnet Dawn"
Date: Wed Mar 10, 2004 7:15 pm

The public should have expected this. Tobacco controls were only the beginning. It's comforting to know how the federal government is spending tax dollars. Excerpt from Wall Street Journal, March 10, 2004 http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20040310111109990015
:
"There should not be a parent in the U.S. who has not heard that... our children are projected to have a shorter life expectancy than their parents," says David Katz, a preventive medicine specialist at the Yale University School of Medicine. "Children are being more harmed by poor diet than by exposure to alcohol, drugs and tobacco combined."

Aside from the ad campaigns, current government initiatives to combat obesity include $400 million in funding for obesity-related research in 2004, and $44 million in funding this year for programs to encourage walking and healthier school-food choices in 23 communities. Officials are also considering changes in nutrition-fact panels on packaged foods, and they are revising the nation's dietary guidelines and food pyramid.

Garnet Dawn, Illinois Resident

---

03/06/04 Subject: Welcome
From: "Garnet Dawn"
Date: Sat Mar 6, 2004 1:26 pm

Welcome to Illinois Smokers Group! The purpose of this Group is to provide a meeting place for smokers to exchange ideas, post relevant news articles and discuss pending and current smoking legislation.

Skokie and Wilmette already have smoking bans and Evanston is considering one. Arlington Heights and Wheeling have chosen not to ban smoking. Chicago has already defeated one smoking ban, but the issue is far from closed I have learned that smokers are banding together in news group and organizations all over the world.

I am a member of http://groups.yahoo.com/group/floridasmokers. I want to thank Cheryl Butler, President, Florida Rights, Forces Affiliate and Samantha Phillipe, President, http://www.smokersclub.com for helping me to start this group. I went on vacation in Orlando, FL last year just after the Florida smoking ban was implemented. It was unbelievable to be unable to find a restaurant/bar that allows smoking anywhere inside. If you are interested, go to their group website. (You must become a member to read their posts.) I hope this new Illinois Group will have similar input and that we will be able to help prevent Illinois from further smoking ban legislation.

Other websites of immediate interest to smokers are:
http://www.smokersclub.com/
http://www.forces.org/index.htm Forces International
http://www.antibrains.com/ "Dissecting AntiSmokers' Brains"
http://www.davehitt.com/facts/badforbiz.html Businesses harmed by Smoking Bans
https://mysmokersrights.rjrt.com/SGRHome.jsp My Smokers Rights
http://www.nycclash.com/ New York City, Smokers Lobbying Against Smoker Harassment
http://www.smokingparadise.net/Activists/ Smokers Rights Activists

Sincerely,
Garnet Dawn, Founder Illinois Smokers Group,
http://193.78.190.200/smokersclub/il.htm

---

03/05/04 Subject: New Illinois Smokers Group
From: "Garnet Dawn"
Date: Fri Mar 5, 2004 8:26 pm

Hi Cheryl,

Thanks to both you and Samantha for helping me to create
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/illinoissmokers/. I'm not sure where
this will lead, but I'll learn. Any assistance will be appreciated.

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

---

03/09/04 Response to My Inquiry About Smoking Policies on Cruise Lines
From: Natalie Reach
Date: Tue Mar 9, 2004 8:05 pm
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

I would ask the travel agent which cruise lines are the most smoke-friendly. Whenever I communicate, I always say I am a smoker, and if I can be somewhat anonomous, I say there are at least 10 smokers in our party who want to book reservations.

Always call any establishment, no matter where you are or what you plan to do, and ask about being smoker friendly. If the place is NOT, tell them kindly that you and your large party will not attend. I always add "your property rights are gone, and you no longer are able to make a business decision concerning your customers".

Have a nice day

Natalie

---

03/03/04 Subject: Busch Gardens (and nonexistent ashtray urns) From: "kzjamaica"
Date: Wed Mar 3, 2004 3:55 pm

Hi Cheryl,

These antismokers are really something!

Parks, like the entrances to stores, office buildings, hospitals and shopping malls across the country removed the ashtray urns that most smokers used for extinguishing their cigarettes when smoking became unpopular. Smokers are accustomed to using ashtrays. Now the litter from cigarette butts is one of the excuses antismokers use to outlaw smoking outdoors. People who smoke generally put their cigarettes out when they enter nonsmoking buildings because they have to smoke outside.

Are all maintenance management personnel too dense to realize that supplying ashtray urns at building entrances and outdoors would solve much of the problem. Maintenance people who are already required on any payroll, could dump the ashtrays periodically. Would this not alleviate the problem of cigarettes butts on the ground?

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident
----- Original Message -----
From: Cheryl Butler
To: Florida Smokers
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:07 PM
Subject: [floridasmokers] FW: Smoking Policies


I just received this response from Busch Gardens. It just happens that there concern about the animals happened at the same time as the Smoking Ban!!!!!!!!!
I hear excuses all the time but I may have to put this one at the top of my list!!!

Cheryl

-----Original Message-----
From: Triscornia, Christian
[mailto:Christian.Triscornia@BuschGardens.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:24 PM
To: Cheryl Butler
Subject: RE: Smoking Policies


Dear Cheryl:

Thank you for your latest correspondence. First let me assure you that our
intent was not to disparage our smoking guests. Our park policies are under
continuous review and Busch Gardens Tampa has responded to an overwhelming
number of comments, and similar changes at most other area attractions, to
implement designated smoking areas. In addition, the careless discarding of
cigarette butts has caused animal health problems that we could not ignore.
There was no sinister intent in the introduction of this policy change.

Sincerely,

Christian Y. Triscornia
Guest Relations Specialist
Busch Gardens Tampa Bay/ Adventure Island
P.O.Box 9158
Tampa, FL 33674
Phone 813-987-5885
Fax 813-987-5746
E-Mail Christian.Triscornia@BuschGardens.com

---

02/13/04 "Smoking Ban Hasn't Closed Any Restaurants, Yet" [floridasmokers]
From:"kzjamaica"
Date: Fri Feb 13, 2004 4:06 pm

I read more on Mr. Luebkemann and learned the he is the Director of the Florida Division of Hotels and Restaurants, but he represents the State. http://www.myflorida.com/dbpr/hr/general/index.shtml

"The Division of Hotels and Restaurants (H&R) is in the Department of Business and Professional Regulation within the Executive Branch of Florida's government. It is responsible for licensing, inspecting and regulating public lodging and food service establishments and elevators and other conveyances in the State of Florida."

Illinois Resident

---

02/13/04 Response from Florida Smokers
From: "Brian"
Date: Fri Feb 13, 2004 6:07 am
Subject: Re: "Smoking Ban Hasn't Closed Any Restaurants, Yet"

Where's this Luebkemann guy been? I personally know of two establishments =
closed down forceably and at least one other that
closed its' doors due to the loss of revenues. Not to mention the 20 peopl=
e I personally know of who lost their jobs due directly to the
smoking ban. And that does not include the many I've read about in newspap=
ers.

Brian

---

02/12/04 Florida Smoking News
From: "kzjamaica"
Date: Thu Feb 12, 2004 7:18 pm
Subject: "Smoking Ban Hasn't Closed Any Restaurants, Yet"

Congratulations to Kentucky, and Terry Gray, on Senator Seum's preemption bill passing the State Senate. I am still following your website and wishing you success, since my vacation in Orlando, Florida the end of last year. Skokie, IL now has a complete smoking ban, but Arlington Heights, IL just defeated one.

In case anyone may have missed it, the first article below is copied from the website Tobacco.org. I'm glad Mr. Luebkemann isn't the Director of the Illinois Division of Hotels and Restaurants.

Regarding the second article, shouldn't the charges against the clerks be dropped on the basis of entrapment?

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

------------------------------------
Smoking ban hasn't closed any restaurants, yet
Source: Florida Today, 2004-02-11

Intro:
Dear Help!: The owner of a Brevard restaurant fined for ignoring the no smoking law was quoted in FLORIDA TODAY (Feb. 5) as asking, "Is that the way they make up the difference in the loss of revenue for all the restaurants that have closed?" Can Help! determine what percent of the state's restaurants have been forced to close because of the no smoking law?

While there may be anecdotal stories floating around, the number of forced restaurant closings attributable to the smoking ban is zilch.

"I have no hard evidence of even a single incidence. Certainly, we have not closed anyone," said Geoff Luebkemann, director of the Florida Division of Hotels and Restaurants.
------------------------------------

Sting targets illegal alcohol, tobacco sales
Source: Daytona Beach (FL) News-Journal, 2004-02-10Author: Mark Harper

Intro:
About one-quarter of the West Volusia stores visited recently by undercover law enforcement teams sold alcohol or tobacco to minors.

The Florida Division of Alcoholic Beverages and Tobacco and the Volusia County Sheriff's Office conducted the sting operation Friday. Two teams consisting of one state agent and two underage sheriff's operatives visited approximately 32 stores, said Brandon Haught, a sheriff's public information officer.

Clerks from eight stores were issued written citations

---

01/30/04 Google News Alerts

From: samanthaph@y...
Date: Fri Jan 30, 2004 7:35 am
Subject: Google free alert system

Howdy,
I signed up for free to get daily notes on "smoking bans" articles
from google. It's a great service and you can choose any key words
you want for the service.
Yours,
Samantha
--------------------
GOOGLE NEWS ALERTS. Google calls its lab site at
http://labs.google.com its "technology playground." There are
several interesting beta programs there and one of the more useful is
Google News Alerts. Type the word or phrase you'd like Google to
search for you and indicate whether you want a daily email
notification or as it happens. Keep the search term fairly specific
to avoid a glut in your mailbox.

---

01/15/04 Response to My Letter:

From: "Laura"
Date: Thu Jan 15, 2004 10:53 am
Subject: Re: Smoking/Handicapped Areas in Disney Parks

Dear Illinois Resident,
Yes, the security people at Disney will tell you to put it out or
direct you to the nearest designated smoking area. Other cast members
are to do the same. I always politely tell guests where the nearest
designated area is. I dislike doing this because I am a smoker too,
and can empathize with these guests.
Disney has always placed the handicapped first. That will not change.
The way I look at it, I am greatful for my good health and that I can
still walk on my two legs. Just take a minute to put yourself in that
position. Would you like to be stuck in a wheelchair? And those who
look healthy and can walk short distances, have underlying diseases
that keep them from being entirely mobile. (like heart disease, for
one) Just thank God that you have good health.
Oh, and the security people at Disney do have the right to escort
anyone who disobeys the rules out of the park, with no refund. If you
resist, they call Orange County to come in, and they cuff you and
haul you off to jail. So it is wise not to cause a fuss, and just
obey the park rules.
Hopefully the State of Florida can get this law repealed.
Take care,
~Laura~

---

01/14/04 On Smoking and Handicapped Areas at Disneyland
From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Wed Jan 14, 2004 3:11 pm
Subject: Smoking/Handicapped Areas in Disney Parks

Subj: [floridasmokers] Re: Florida and Disney
Date: 2004/01/14 1:08:29 Central Standard Time
From: Laurazbiz@msn.com
Reply-to: floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com
To: floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com


Laura Wrote: I live in Florida, and I am a smoker. I also work at Disney.
I was appalled when they took smokers rights from us in this state!
Now it is very difficult to find any restaurants or even bars that
allow smoking indoors.
Also, at Disney, they now have designated smoking areas even outdoors!
The only place in the Magic Kingdom where you can actually smoke in
an outdoor eating establishment is at The Plaza Restaurant near the
Plaza Pavilion. It is bad at the resorts as well. You have to darn
near go out to the parking lot to have a smoke!
The only place on Disney property I have found where you can actually
smoke inside is at the Boardwalk at JellyRolls where they have the
dueling pianos show.
Hi Laura,

We vacationed in Florida recently and spent several days at the Magic Kingdom, Epcott, Animal World and MGM. Even with the maps provided by Disney, we found the "smoking areas" difficult to locate. Initially, every day, we would try to comply with smoking only in the smoking areas. As the day progressed and we saw other smokers in outdoor areas "cupping" their cigarettes in their hands, we did the same. No one bothered us while the parks were open. We did have a security guard approach us at both Magic Kingdom and Epcott after the parks were closed and the fireworks ended, while we were sitting and waiting for the park to clear out. Each one told us that smoking was not allowed. The guard at Magic Kingdom was rude, the one at Epcott polite. I extinguished my cigarette in each case, my boyfriend "cupped" his and we walked away. I then relit another cigarette.

The guard at Magic Kingdom was more upset that we were sitting on a bench on a "handicapped only" bridge than the fact that we were smoking, although all the "handicapped" signs had been removed for the fireworks. (We had been directed to the bridge by the employees in the gigantic cafe close by, for the best viewing of the castle fireworks.) There were no signs designating the area, until we looked at the Magic Kingdom map afterward.

I may be broaching an untouchable topic, but it is an unusual experience to realize that non-handicapped people are second class citizens at Disney World. All the prime seating in the auditoriums is devoted to the handicapped and their parties. I don't mind being considerate of handicapped people, but I began to feel as if I was a second class citizen for being healthy.

I'm glad we made our "once in a lifetime" trip to DisneyWorld before the antismoking police have had time to organize themselves to prohibit outdoor smoking further. Incidentally, Six Flags Great America in Gurnee, Illinois still does not restrict outdoor smoking.

Laura Wrote: I have been watching some of the posts, and it takes less than 2
hours to travel from Clearwater to Disney. I can do it in 1 hour and
20 minutes.

I think the Clearwater area would make a very nice vacation in itself, but the issue of the distance between Clearwater and the Disney Parks is really irrelevant. To most visitors, unless they have friends or family in Clearwater, the focus of their vacation is on making the most out of the time they have to visit the Orlando attractions.

Good luck with fighting the smoking ban in Florida.

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

01/12/04 Terry on Maureen Girard:

From: "Terry Gray"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 12:27 pm
Subject: RE: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

If this person isn’t an anti she is too flexible for my tastes. I want nothing more to do with her. She seems intent upon appeasing other smokers and luring them into accepting the restrictions.

Terry Gray
President - Forces Kentucky

-----Original Message-----
From: Maureen Girard [mailto:maureengirard@yahoo.com

---

01/12/04 Terry Responding to Maureen's Last Letter

From: "Terry Gray"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 12:19 pm
Subject: RE: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

I don’t “play” at all when it comes to Nazis pushing their agendas on me. This isn’t a sandbox. Do you think our founding fathers were playing when they were fighting and dying? “70% of the ship is smoking. What’s the problem?” The problem is that that is just the beginning. Every inch they take leads to another foot of the erosion of our rights. No, I don’t play lady.

Terry Gray
President - Forces Kentucky

---

01/12/04 Maureen Again:
Maureen's post is bolded, mine is italacized.

From: "Maureen Girard"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 12:14 pm
Subject: Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

In floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com, kzjamaica@a... wrote:
In a message dated 2004/01/12 9:03:05 Central Standard Time,
maureengirard@y... writes:

Dear Maureen,

Thank you for your input. Please be specific. To which cruise
line(s) are you referring?

Princess and Carnival.

You state "We take cruises and the smoking policies are not an
issue with most of us."

That is the reason why smokers are receiving less
and less consideration for smoking areas everywhere.

About 70% of the ship is smoking. That's fine. What's the problem?

I am also curious about your meaning when you say "Unless you want
to pick a fight, you shouldn't have any problems."

Your messages indicate that if you can't have what you want, you
won't "play." Life doesn't work that way.

Maureen

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

01/12/04 Terry, Regarding Maureen's Response on Cruise Lines.

From: "Terry Gray"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:27 am
Subject: RE: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

Maureen,

As I see it you are giving bad advice. Your sentiment may be in the right place but your heart isn’t. This isn’t about where we can find a place to crawl off and smoke. Do you not pay the same amount of money for your cruise as a non-smoker? I’m sure that you do and yet you accept fewer rights. You seem to be delighted that you are allowed to smoke anywhere and accept it as the way it is. That is a problem. As long as you go along with their rules you are subservient to their laws, ideologies, and whims. How long do you think it will be before there will be no smoking on the ships at all? That will happen because you and those that think like you just go along with the rules.

“Unless you pick a fight.”? What the hell is that? The fight has already been picked and if you respect your rights you will be a soldier in the war. If you don’t fight then you are subject to the same Nazi ideologies that have crippled many a society. Is that what you want? Do you want everything dictated to you?

In this battle you are either in it to the butt cheeks or you are on their side. Which is it Maureen?

Terry Gray
President - Forces Kentucky

---

01/12/04 Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation
From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:14 am
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers]

maureengirard@yahoo.com writes:

We take cruises and the smoking policies are not an issue with most
of us. Smoking is fine in the staterooms and many other areas.
There is no smoking in the formal restaurants. The serving areas on
the Lido deck are also nonsmoking but you can take your food to a
smoking area. There is no smoking in the theatre areas, the halls,
the library, or the computer areas. There are extensive seating
areas located all over the ship with ashtrays.
Unless you want to pick a fight, you shouldn't have any problems.
Maureen


Dear Maureen,

Thank you for your input. Please be specific. To which cruise line(s) are you referring?

You state "We take cruises and the smoking policies are not an issue with most of us." That is the reason why smokers are receiving less and less consideration for smoking areas everywhere.

I am also curious about your meaning when you say "Unless you want to pick a fight, you shouldn't have any problems."

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

01/12/04 Cheryl takes off her gloves with Maureen.

From: "Cheryl Butler"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:11 am
Subject: FW: The State Of Florida

--- In floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com, "Cheryl Butler"
wrote to Maureen (Cheryl's comments in this post are bolded, Maureen's are italicized:

> Maureen's response: Disney is actually about 90 miles from Clearwater.>

It may only be 90 miles but the traffic is horrible so would take you at least 2 hours. It is like driving in a parking lot.

>I've been making that run for 12 years and I have seldom found those
conditions. In fact, if you time your trip outside of rush hours, it takes about 90 minutes.
Are you sure you live in the State Of Florida???

> Maureen's response: Of course, this is a given. The other given is Florida is warm and there are many restaurants with outdoor seating. In fact, a number of these nice places are located on the "strip" right outside of Disney.
> Maureen, the point is that if you are vacationing here you shouldn't have to be searching around for restaurants with outdoor seating. If you are not familiar with the state it can be a very stressful experience.

>Come on--if you have eyes, outdoor seating is easy to spot.I don't know what planet you live on. When you are driving on Route 192, it is impossible to spot outdoor seating.

>Question: Are you a smoker??>>

>I sure am.

>As a smoker I encourage people to stay away from the State of Florida so tourism dollars will go down and the legislators will start taking notice. >>

>You obviously didn't follow the situation. I most certainly followed the situation. I agree this result is because of the referendum , however, I disagree with you as far as the legislators. When writing the actual law they were influenced by the American Lung Association and many things that were not suppose to happen did. The nonsmoking mess is a result of a public referendum--not an action of the legislature.

The problem exists because smokers and other property rights advocates didn't get out there and vote.

>> A smoker should not have to be treated like a second class citizen when they are spending their hard earned money on a vacation here.>>

>I agree. Blame it on voter apathy.

> Too bad we didn't ask you before our trip. I hope your advice will be helpful to others in the future, but I prefer to have the choice of dining indoors.

> Don't settle for anything less!!! Find another state that is smoker friendly.>>

> Smoker friendly places are very hard to find.

> Maureen's response: I have no idea who advised you but please remember that outdoor seating exist. The other thing is that even if it doesn't exist, many restaurants have nice benches right outside and they will serve coffee, tea, etc.> Can you provide the group with your list of outdoor seating restaurants???>>

>I can do that for my immediate area. I tend to be more flexible
when traveling. I would rather be flexible than house bound.

Your complacency about smoking bans is part of our problem.

Restaurants that provide "nice benches" outside would not get my
business. If they don't care about their property rights then why would I patronize their establishment. If you are a smoker I cannot believe that you would be telling other smokers just to take it and except it.

>Most restaurant owners don't like the law either but they are stuck
with it. Again, the problem started because of voter apathy. It would take another referendum to change the law.

Exactly my point about restaurant owners. They are 'just taking it like you'. >

>Our hotel, among others, advised us. Before our vacation in Florida, I
wrote to floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com and said that we did not intend to go to restaurants where we could not smoke.>>

>Sorry, but smoking in restaurants simply won't happen unless you eat
outside.

There are still some smoking restaurants around. Applaud these restaurant owners! You talk about voter apathy, and I agree, but you are just going along and telling other people to just go along. If you believed in Property Rights and our civil liberties you wouldn't be 'just taking it"!

> Maureen's response: In the Keys, outdoor seating is almost a norm.
> Agree, a lot of restaurants on the coast do provide outdoor seating.

> That's too bad--no air-conditioning? >>

>Come on. Florida weather is fine. You won't melt.

>Are we not good enough for air conditioning!! Maureen seems to forget about the brutal summers we have here. I certainly do not want to be sitting outside having a meal with the sweat dripping into my food!!!!>>

Good heavens, Florida summers are not that brutal. We have a constant breeze. My advice to people who don't like a tropical climate is simple--move to Alaska.

Like I said before what planet do you live on?? You sure don't live in Florida in the summers. Maybe you are one of those "SNOWBIRDS"!!


Maureen

---

01/12/04 Maureen on Cruise Lines:

From: "Maureen Girard"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 9:00 am
Subject: Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

In floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com, kzjamaica@a... wrote:
> Dear Cheryl,
>
> Thanks so much for your support.
>
> I am beginning to research a cruise to Alaska for this coming
August or September. If anyone has any knowledge of smoking policies on
various cruise lines, I would appreciate the input--even though this is not directly related to Florida smoking issues.>>

We take cruises and the smoking policies are not an issue with most of us. Smoking is fine in the staterooms and many other areas.
There is no smoking in the formal restaurants. The serving areas on
the Lido deck are also nonsmoking but you can take your food to a
smoking area. There is no smoking in the theatre areas, the halls,
the library, or the computer areas. There are extensive seating
areas located all over the ship with ashtrays.
Unless you want to pick a fight, you shouldn't have any problems.
Maureen>
> Sincerely,
> Illinois Resident

---

01/12/04 Maureen, BACK AGAIN!

From: "Maureen Girard"
Date: Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:54 am
Subject: Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

In floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com, "Cheryl Butler"
wrote:
Dear Cheryl,
> Dear Maureen,
>
> Maureen's response: Disney is actually about 90 miles from
Clearwater.
>
> It may only be 90 miles but the traffic is horrible so would
take you at least 2 hours. It is like driving in a parking lot.>>
I've been making that run for 12 years and I have seldom found those
conditions. In fact, if you time your trip outside of rush hours,
it takes about 90 minutes.
> Maureen's response: Of course, this is a given. The other
given is Florida is warm and there are many restaurants with outdoor seating. In fact, a number of these nice places are located on the "strip" right outside of Disney.
> Maureen, the point is that if you are vactioning here you
shouldn't have to be searching around for restaurants with outdoor seating. If you are not familiar with the state it can be a very stressful experience.>>
Come on--if you have eyes, outdoor seating is easy to spot.
> Question: Are you a smoker??>>
I sure am.

> As a smoker I encourage people to stay away from the State of Florida so tourism dollars will go down and the legislators will start taking notice. >>

You obviously didn't follow the situation. The nonsmoking mess is a result of a public referendum--not an action of the legislature.
The problem exists because smokers and other property rights
advocates didn't get out there and vote.>> A smoker should not have to be treated like a second class citizen when they are spending their hard earned money on a vacation here.>>

I agree. Blame it on voter apathy.
> Too bad we didn't ask you before our trip. I hope your advice
will be helpful to others in the future, but I prefer to have the choice
of dining indoors.
> Don't settle for anything less!!! Find another state that is
smoker friendly.>>
Smoker friendly places are very hard to find.
>
> Maureen's response: I have no idea who advised you but please
remember that outdoor seating exist. The other thing is that even if it doesn't exist, many restaurants have nice benches right outside and they will serve coffee, tea, etc.
> Can you provide the group with your list of outdoor seating restaurants???>>

I can do that for my immediate area. I tend to be more flexible
when traveling. I would rather be flexible than house bound.
> Restaurants that provide "nice benches" outside would not get my
business.
> If they don't care about their property rights then why would I
patronize their establishment. If you are a smoker I cannot believe that you would be telling other smokers just to take it and except it.>>

Most restaurant owners don't like the law either but they are stuck with it. Again, the problem started because of voter apathy. It
would take another referendum to change the law.>>> Our hotel, among others, advised us. Before our vacation in Florida, I wrote to floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com and said that we did not intend to go to restaurants where we could not smoke.>>

Sorry, but smoking in restuarants simply won't happen unless you eat outside.>

> Maureen's response: In the Keys, outdoor seating is almost a
norm.
> Agree, alot of restaurants on the coast do provide outdoor
seating.
>
> That's too bad--no air-conditioning? >>
Come on. Florida weather is fine. You won't melt.

>Are we not good enough for air conditioning!! Maureen seems to forget about the brutal summers we have here. I certainly do not want to be sitting outside having a meal with the sweat dripping into my > food!!!!>>

Good heavens, Florida summers are not that brutal. We have a
constant breeze. My advice to people who don't like a tropical
climate is simple--move to Alaska.
Maureen

---

01/10/04 Thanking Cheryl for her help:
From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Sat Jan 10, 2004 11:52 am
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

Dear Cheryl,

Thanks so much for your support.

I am beginning to research a cruise to Alaska for this coming August or September. If anyone has any knowledge of smoking policies on various cruise lines, I would appreciate the input--even though this is not directly related to Florida smoking issues.

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

01/10/04 Help with Maureen from Cheryl:

From: "Cheryl Butler"
Date: Sat Jan 10, 2004 9:44 am
Subject: RE: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

Dear Illinois Resident,
I am adding my comments
Cheryl

Dear Maureen,

Illinois wrote: Thank you for your suggestion. The only problem is Clearwater is
105.5 miles and approximately 2 hours away from Orlando.

Maureen's response: Disney is actually about 90 miles from Clearwater.

It may only be 90 miles but the traffic is horrible so would take you at least 2 hours. It is like driving in a parking lot.
Illinois wrote: I referenced 'Yahoo Maps Driving Directions" for the distance between Orlando and Clearwater, but no point in splitting hairs.

Illinois: I'm sure Clearwater is very nice and located close to the Gulf, but for vacationers time is of the essence

Maureen's response: Of course, this is a given. The other given is Florida is warm and there are many restaurants with outdoor seating. In fact, a number of these nice places are located on the "strip" right outside of Disney.

Maureen, the point is that if you are vactioning here you shouldn't have to be searching around for restaurants with outdoor seating. If you are not familiar with the state it can be a very stressful experience.
Question: Are you a smoker?? As a smoker I encourage people to stay away from the State of Florida so tourism dollars will go down and the legislators will start taking notice. A smoker should not have to be treated like a second class citizen when they are spending their hard earned money on a vacation here.
Too bad we didn't ask you before our trip. I hope your advice will be helpful to others in the future, but I prefer to have the choice of dining indoors.

Don't settle for anything less!!! Find another state that is smoker friendly.

Illinois: As I said, we were advised of restaurants prior to our trip that allowed smoking. They did not.

Maureen's response: I have no idea who advised you but please remember that outdoor seating exist. The other thing is that even if it doesn't exist, many restaurants have nice benches right outside and they will serve coffee, tea, etc.

Can you provide the group with your list of outdoor seating restaurants??? Restaurants that provide "nice benches" outside would not get my business. If they don't care about their property rights then why would I patronize their establishment. If you are a smoker I cannot believe that you would be telling other smokers just to take it and except it.

Illinois: Our hotel, among others, advised us. Before our vacation in Florida, I wrote to floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com and said that we did not intend to go to restaurants where we could not smoke.

Illinois: If we are going to fly down to Florida again, rent a car and want
to explore the Keys--we don't want searching for a restaurant where we can relax to be an issue.

Maureen's response: In the Keys, outdoor seating is almost a norm.
Agree, alot of restaurants on the coast do provide outdoor seating.

That's too bad--no air-conditioning? We will still continue to boycott all nonsmoking restaurants, including those in Illinois.

Good for you!!!! Are we not good enough for air conditioning!! Maureen seems to forget about the brutal summers we have here. I certainly do not want to be sitting outside having a meal with the sweat dripping into my food!!!!

You know I keep saying "If you are not allowed to smoke and be treated like an ordinary citizen, then stay away!!!!!"

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

01/09/04 Letter back to Maureen:
From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Fri Jan 9, 2004 11:07 pm
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers] Re: Searching for Smoking Restaurants While on Vacation

Dear Maureen,

Illinois wrote: Thank you for your suggestion. The only problem is Clearwater is
105.5 miles and approximately 2 hours away from Orlando.

Maureen's response: Disney is actually about 90 miles from Clearwater.

I referenced 'Yahoo Maps Driving Directions" for the distance between Orlando and Clearwater, but no point in splitting hairs.

Illinois: I'm sure Clearwater is very nice and located close to the Gulf, but for vacationers time is of the essence.

Maureen's response: Of course, this is a given. The other given is Florida is warm and there are many restaurants with outdoor seating. In fact, a number of these nice places are located on the "strip" right outside of Disney.

Too bad we didn't ask you before our trip. I hope your advice will be helpful to others in the future, but I prefer to have the choice of dining indoors.

Illinois: As I said, we were advised of restaurants prior to our trip that allowed smoking. They did not.

Maureen's response: I have no idea who advised you but please remember that outdoor seating exist. The other thing is that even if it doesn't exist, many restaurants have nice benches right outside and they will serve coffee, tea, etc.

Our hotel, among others, advised us. Before our vacation in Florida, I wrote to floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com and said that we did not intend to go to restaurants where we could not smoke.

Illinois: If we are going to fly down to Florida again, rent a car and want to explore the Keys--we don't want searching for a restaurant where we can relax to be an issue.

Maureen's response: In the Keys, outdoor seating is almost a norm.

That's too bad--no air-conditioning? We will still continue to boycott all nonsmoking restaurants, including those in Illinois.

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

01/07/04 Maureen @ Florida Smokers' response to my letter on FL Restaurants:

From: "Maureen Girard"
Date: Wed Jan 7, 2004 8:17 pm
Subject: Re: Thank You to Natalie for Bumper Stickers

In floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com, kzjamaica@a... wrote:
...we will not return until we can find comfortable restaurants
again.>>

Many restaurants have outdoor areas where you can smoke. I live in
Clearwater and there are 3 in my immediate area that have this type
of seating.

Maureen

---

01/07/04 Letter to Natalie @ Florida Smokers

From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Wed Jan 7, 2004 12:57 pm
Subject: Thank You to Natalie for Bumper Stickers

Dear Natalie,

A belated "thank you" for the bumper stickers you sent to Mike and me. We will use them in Illinois. We are still following the progress of floridasmokersrights@yahoo.com and rooting for Florida smokers fighting the smoking ban. As I mentioned in an earlier e-mail, we did not patronize nonsmoking restaurants while we were vacationing in Florida (and staying in Kissimmee) for two weeks the end of last November and the beginning of December. Other than the dinner shows at Arabian Knights, Medieval Times and the Dolly Parton Show we ate in our room or at the Disney Parks. It's a shame we weren't able to enjoy any Florida restaurants with smoking areas, but not being acquainted with the Orlando area we just went back to the hotel.

I have a suggestion, though I don't know how practical its application would be, someone should create a restaurant guide (with directions) for visitors who desire restaurants with smoking areas. We were told (via e-mail prior to our vacation) of restaurants in Kissimmee that allowed smoking, yet when we went to them we were told that they didn't allow smoking or the smoking areas had been reduced to tables with no chairs and no service. A visitor has enough challenge driving from the airport to their hotel, finding their way to the Disney Parks, Universal, etc. without searching endlessly for a smoking restaurants.

I hope the Smoking Ban is repealed in the next year or two, so that we may return to visit the Keys. As it stands now, I've finally seen Disney World and we will not return until we can find comfortable restaurants again.

Sincerely,
Garnet & Mike

---

12/12/03 Response from Orlando Chamber of Commerce and my original Letter of Inquiry on Florida Smoking Policies:

From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:02 pm
Subject: Response from Orlando Chamber of Commerce to Potential Vacationers

To Whom It May Concern:

Following is a copy of original letter I referred to in my initial e-mail to Florida Smokers.com, along with Jacob V. Stuart's response. Of course, it reveals our identities but also validates my earlier e-mail. If there is any way we may be of help to modify the new Smoking Ordinanaces in FL, please let us know. We would like to take a driving vacation through the Florida Keys, but strongly desire restaurants with smoking accomodations available before we consider another trip to Florida. As I wrote earlier, we refused to patronize nonsmoking Florida restaurants during our recent vacation.

Incidentally, we did go into "Florida's Smoke & Snuff" in the Florida Mall in Orlando while visiting. This was the only place in the mall where we could smoke, and we were welcome! I must admit, I found it strange to be allowed to smoke in a small shop in the center of the mall. It must make the antismokers furious.

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

P.S. I have requested two "If You Can't Smoke, Don't Go There" bumpers stickers. Illinois is also anticipating more bar/restaurant smoking bans.
--------------------------------------

Subj: I Found THE E-MAIL !


----- Forwarded by Michael xxxxxxx/US/ABNAMRO/NL on 12/11/2003 01:42 PM

Michael xxxxxxxxxx
To: KZJAMAICA@aol.com
10/07/2003 04:45 cc:
PM Subject: Re: Fwd: Feedback Form(Document link: Michael xxxxxxxx)

This guy would piss off the MOUSE ............................ He
probably gets asked to leave so a place can have 'Happy Hour" !

Mike
KZJAMAICA@aol.co
m To: Michael.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.com
cc:
10/03/2003 09:29 Subject: Fwd: Feedback Form

------------------------------------------------------------------------

----- Message from "Jacob V. Stuart" on Fri, 3
Oct 2003 21:48:17 -0400 -----

To: "'kzjamaica@aol.com'"

cc: Management Team


Subject: RE: Feedback Form

Today, in Florida, as a matter of public policy and as a matter of law...

...it's illegal to smoke in any "work environment" or public building.
And, as you have suggested, this positive "change in our life styles"
includes all restaurants.

Thankfully, in my opinion, the voters of the State of Florida, in an
overwhelming majority, chose to bring about this "healthy change" for our
citizens and our guests.

Thankfully, too, there are many wonderful opportunities for you to continue
to enjoy your "special tastes" and, at the same time, allow others in your
company to do the same.

Very much, I appreciate your sharing your feelings with me and please know
that while I believe that honoring our new law may interrupt some business
obligations and opportunities...

... I also believe, in the long run, it will enrich our individual lives
and the lives of our families.

Enjoy your holiday...

...and know it is my wish you will choose to do so in our very special
community.

Jacob V. Stuart
President
Orlando Regional Chamber of Commerce
Direct Dial: 407.835.2517
Email: jacob.stuart@orlando.org
Web: www.orlando.org

------------------------------------------------------------------------

-----Original Message-----
From: kzjamaica@aol.com [mailto:kzjamaica@aol.com]
Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 9:27 PM
To: jacob.stuart@orlando.org
Subject: Feedback Form

==========================================
Client Feedback
==========================================
Contact : Garnet Dawn
Email : kzjamaica@aol.com
Phone : 847/xxxxxxxxxx
Organization :
Position :
Subject : Smoking in Restaurants
Comments : My boyfriend and I were planning to visit Orlando and stay at the Comfort Inn in Kissimmee for two weeks at the end of November and beginning of December. We both smoke.

Now, we have learned that all the restaurants are non-smoking and are
considering vacationing elsewhere. I have never been to DisneyWorld, but the thought of eating at McDonalds for two weeks is not appealing. We normally enjoy fine restaurants, but will not patronize non-smoking
restaurants.

Are there restaurants with patio dining where we can smoke during dinner? If not, we are ready to cancel our hotel accomodations and are now hesitating to purchase airline tickets.

Because we are only a party of two we may not be important to Florida's
hospitality industry, but I would appreciate an answer so that we can make an informed decision about where to take our vacation.

Sincerely,
Garnet Dawn

---

12/08/03 My follow-up letter on our vacation in Orland, FL
From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Mon Dec 8, 2003 12:53 pm
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers] News from Castaway's

Hi Cheryl,

Thanks for asking. I'm afraid we did very poorly.

We first tried Old Town by our Comfort Inn in Kissimmee on the evening we arrived. We had been told that Blue Max, El Quijote Spanish Restaurant and Damons allowed smoking outside. Blue Max and Damons did not and El Quijote's menu was a little to exotic after traveling all day. Damons had tables outside, but had removed the chairs. The waitress in Damons (which was almost empty) began and continued a lecture (as we were walking out the door) telling us that we would not find smoking restaurants in Florida. We then went to Flippers, sat outside and had wine and a pizza. It was chilly and damp. The waitress at Flippers told us that nonsmoking policies were not hurting Flippers. We were one of two parties at Flippers that evening. Sounds like the employees/waitress have been well coached.

After the first evening, we either attended dinner shows or ordered out. We had Arby's, Kentucky Colonel, barbecued ribs and hamburgers in our hotel room and went to three dinner shows: Arabian Nights (spectacular - four stars), Medieval Times (terrific - three and a half stars) and the Dolly Parton Show (nice - one and a half stars). We don't expect to smoke at dinner shows, and we thoroughly enjoyed ourselves.

We also ate at the Disney parks (Epcot, Magic Kingdom, Animal World and MGM), then had our after-dinner cigarettes in smoking (or sometimes non-smoking) areas. Sometimes the park staff employees just look the other way.

We only tried two bars: Ruby Tuesday's at the Florida Mall (after shopping) and TGI Friday's (which we had been told had a smoking area but did not. TGI Fridays was also a proud host to almost empty dining rooms). We had one drink each time, voicing our objection to the nonsmoking law, and left.

The Disney Parks were well worth the trip. Somehow, we still didn't manage to see everything but enjoyed endless rides, tours, attractions, lights and fireworks displays. The trip was well worth it. We were frozen two evenings, roasted a couple of days and rained on during Fantazmic but thoroughly enjoyed ourselves.

Florida is beautiful, but Kissimmee is back-to-back hotels, neon and fast food restaurants. We read in the local paper about restaurants with outdoor smoking areas in Orlando, but we really were too busy and tired from sightseeing to go searching for restaurants 30 minutes away at the end of a day. We found the fridge and microwave in our mini-suite were our best friends.

Once we arrived home from our flight yesterday, we went to one of our favorite restaurants and had a couple of martinis, steak and an after dinner drink in the smoking section.

Sincerely,
An Illinois Resident

P.S. My boyfriend is checking his old e-mails at work to see if he still has a copy on file of the letter I received from the President of the Orlando Chamber of Commerce prior to our vacation.

---

12/08/04 From: "Cheryl Butler"
Date: Mon Dec 8, 2003 10:00 am
Subject: RE: [floridasmokers] News from Castaway's

Hi,

So tell us about your trip to Florida!! How did you make out finding restaurants with outdoor patios??

Cheryl

---

11/22/03 First is Cheryl's Letter to the Orlando Chamber of Commerce, then my letter to the Florida newspapers.

From: "Cheryl Butler"
Date: Sat Nov 22, 2003 2:47 pm
Subject: Orlando Chamber --Follow Up

Hi Everyone,

Just wanted to let you all know that I just sent this letter to all
the Orlando City officials, including the mayor. I also forwarded to
all the other Chamber members.
Let's see what happens!!!

Best Regards, Cheryl


Dear Orlando City Officials,

I am forwarding you an e-mail I just received regarding the attitude
of the City Of Orlando's Chamber President Jacob Stuart. I find it
absolutely outrageous that a representative of your city would
dismiss a dinning concern raised by a smoker.

Our group would like to know if this is the overall feeling of The
City Of Orlando or just the personal feelings of the Chamber
President . It seems his attitude is "Don't bother visiting Orlando
if you smoke, you won't get any information from us."
If this is the feeling of the Orlando City Officials then we will
certainly make this more public than we already have.



From: KZJAMAICA@a...
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 2:09 PM
To: insight@orlandosentinel; dstate@orlandosentinel;
jhealy@orlandosentinel; news@o...; jebbush@m...

Subject: Smoking Ban in Orlando, FL

I posted this e-mail yesterday on floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com. I
received a very welcome suggestion from a member of the group that suggested I forward my letter to the Governor and newspapers in Florida. My boyfriend and I are vacationing in Orlando's cool, slow season. I wonder what will happen to tourism next summer. I have already read that the sluggish economy has hurt hotels in your area.

Sincerely,
An Illinois Resident

---

11/22/03 To Florida Smokers:

From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Sat Nov 22, 2003 12:51 pm
Subject: Re: [floridasmokers]

Hi,

Thanks for contacting me. I promise I will write, once we return from our vacation.

Sincerely,
Illinois Resident

---

11/21/03 To Florida Smokers:
From: kzjamaica@a...
Date: Fri Nov 21, 2003 1:08 pm
Subject: Smoking Ban in Orlando, FL
I posted this e-mail yesterday on floridasmokers@yahoogroups.com. I received a very welcome suggestion from a member of the group that I forward my letter to the Governor and newspapers in Florida. My boyfriend and I are vacationing in Orlando's cool, slow season. I wonder what will happen to tourism next summer. I have already read that the sluggish economy has hurt hotels in your area.

Sincerely,
An Illinois Resident

---

11/20/03 Cheryl Butler's first response to me from Florida Smokers:

From: "Cheryl Butler"
Date: Thu Nov 20, 2003 3:01 pm
Subject: Welcome To Florida!!

Hello Illinois Resident,

I can sympathize with your dilemma! I live in Florida and I have
not patronized one restaurant since the ban went into effect.

I would like to make a suggestion to you! E-mail the letter you
sent to the group (it was perfect) to the following
newspapers/people.

Orlando Sentinel
insight@orlandosentinel
dstate@orlandosentinel
jhealy@orlandosentinel

Orlando Times
news@o...

Our Illustrious Governor:
jebbush@m...

We have to let the public/politicians know tourism is being affected
by this smoking ban!!

We, as Floridians would certainly appreciate this!!!!

Thanks,
Cheryl

---

11/20/03 This makes me nostalgic. It was my first letter to Florida Smokers.

From: "gzjamaica"
Date: Thu Nov 20, 2003 2:18 pm
Subject: Smoking Ban in Orlando, FL

My boyfriend and I are planning to vacation in Orlando Nov. 23 thru
Dec. 7. When I became aware of the new smoking ban in Florida
restaurants, I wrote an e-mail to the President of the Orlando
Chamber of Commerce asking which restaurants in the area had patio
dining because we both smoke and will not patronize non-smoking
restaurants. His response was a very stupid letter preaching how
proud he was that Florida had banned smoking in all it's restaurants
and that he imagined we would be able to find places where other
people with our vice also dined.

Public relations at DisneyWorld and the Kissimmee Comfort Inn (where
we will be staying) were far more helpful. With the current smoking
laws, I believe this will be our first and last vacation in Florida.
We want to see DisneyWorld, Seaworld and Universal just once though.
I am sorry for the restaurant owners in your state.

Residents should know that the President of the Orlando Chamber of
Commerce's has an attitude that will drive away many potential
vacationers who smoke.

His name is
Jacob V. Stuart
jacob.stuart@o...
(407) 835-2517

Sincerely,
An Illinois Resident

---

The following article is frightening but well worth reading and remembering. It's source is http://168.144.6.51/src//1984/thestar-Vaccines-may-prevent-nicotine-addiction-02-06-23.htm from "SRC StephenH" at www.SmokersRightsCanada.org
admin@smokersrightscanada.org

Jun. 23, 2002, Page A3
Vaccines may prevent nicotine addiction
Could inoculations for teenagers be next?
ANDY COGHLAN
SPECIAL TO THE STAR
Should all teenagers be given a vaccine that blocks the effects of nicotine and so prevents them from becoming addicted to the evil weed?

This controversial possibility is on the horizon thanks to the development of two pioneering vaccines for nicotine addiction. The vaccines were designed for people who repeatedly relapse after giving up smoking. But since most countries are failing to cut the number of children and teenagers taking up cigarettes, many will ask if the vaccines should be used far more widely if they prove to be effective.

One, developed by the Florida company Nabi Biopharmaceuticals, began safety trials this week on 20 non-smokers. The other vaccine, made by the British drug company Xenova, has just successfully completed the first stage of testing on 50 smokers and 10 non-smokers.

Both vaccines work by stimulating the immune system to make antibodies against nicotine. Once an antibody binds to nicotine, the resulting complex is too big to get into the brain, and so can't activate the "pleasure" receptors that generate the drug's addictive buzz.

The body doesn't naturally make antibodies to nicotine because the molecule is too small. But if you attach nicotine to a large protein, as both companies have, the immune system can see it and churn out antibodies that target nicotine alone. The idea is to get the body to make enough antibodies to mop up any nicotine before it reaches the brain, although animal studies suggest that the way such vaccines work is more complicated.

The vaccines will be tested first on relapsing smokers, then those who want to quit, then those who're not yet completely hooked, says Frank Vocci of the National Institute on Drug Abuse near Washington, D.C., which co-sponsored the Nabi vaccine. The final leap would be vaccinating youngsters before they even try smoking, but Vocci says that's a long way down the road.

John Roberts, Xenova's medical director, is more gung-ho. "I think prevention offers a huge opportunity," he says. "If you can take away the pleasure from the outset, children are more likely to kick the experiment early. It normally takes several cigarettes to build up addiction.''

Eighty per cent of smokers start in their teens, with 360,000 teenagers and children in the United States alone taking up the habit last year.

"But there are civil liberties issues. Who will decide which individuals are most at risk of becoming smokers and suggest they take the vaccine?" says Amanda Sandford of Action on Smoking and Health (ASH), a London-based anti-smoking charity. Instead, she favours education as a way of discouraging youngsters from smoking.

Mark Soufliers of Nabi is also cautious. "The challenge is at what age you'd give the vaccine, and whether you'd need to give regular boosters. Also, how much right does the child have to say no?''

nEW SCIENTIST NEWS SERVICE

Legal Notice:- Copyright 1996-2002. Toronto Star Newspapers Limited. All rights reserved. Distribution, transmission or republication of any material from http://www.thestar.com/ is strictly prohibited without the prior written permission of Toronto Star Newspapers Limited. For information please contact us using our webmaster form.

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